• Jake
    • March 27th, 2013

    Nice hatchet job – you never disappoint. Of course, Simpson and Gray said absolutely nothing anti-gay, but so nice of you to spin it that way nonetheless. Their focus was that the Office of Religious Freedom is headed by a religious bigot – particularly an anti-Christian bigot – and as Christians, they have a problem with that. But go ahead, keep on hating… why should we expect anything different from you?

    • dentedbluemercedes
    • March 27th, 2013

    Then obviously we have different definitions of anti-gay, because there are ample examples in RKR’s webcasts. I do not consider (as just a few examples):

    • equating LGBT people with sexual predators
    • trying to defend bullying that targets LGBT kids
    • seeking the right to exclude them from society wherever one might encounter them, in the name of practicing one’s faith and conscience
    • supporting the idea of banning LGBT advocacy, LGBT-positive publications, events, etc
    • pushing people to try to become “cured” of being who they are, or
    • seeing a bill that would kill or at least imprison people for life for being gay as being an acceptable consequence of “fighting the gay agenda”

    to be acts of God’s love.

    We also appear to disagree on what is anti-Christian, if you believe that it means:

    • denying one the ability to legislate theological morality (i.e. the abortion debate, opposition to LGBT-inclusive human rights laws, the fight to ban same-sex marriage…),
    • denying one a license to badger people to a point of harassment (i.e. blocking, shaming and vitriol outside abortion clinics) or incitement (i.e. papering campuses and neighbourhoods with conflations between being gay and pedophilia, graphic portrayals of anal warts, etc, a la Whatcott), or
    • denying one the ability to deliberately disenfranchise people by denying them a job, a home or access to amenities / services.

    Losing the ability to dictate everyone else’s lives to them or drive people into hiding is not the same thing as persecution.

    I believe in Canadians’ rights to their faiths (including but not limited to the many variants of Christianity), to openly practice their faiths (though not to the limit of deliberate infringement on the rights of others), and yes, to speak their faiths (though not to the limit of harassment or incitement). If, on the other hand, I sought to do the same things that RKR folks would like — that is, to ban Christian Pride events (they happen every Sunday), fire people because they’re Christian, urge people of faith to be deprogrammed, claim that all religious people were child molesters… then yes, that would be anti-Christian.

    But I don’t. My issue is with narrow tenets of an extreme brand of faith that attempts to pass itself off as being what all of “Christianity” is.

    Do you, on the other hand, believe in LGBT peoples’ rights to be gay or trans, to openly express who they are in public, and to speak openly about their lives and views? Say it with a straight face next time you’re seeking to ban a kids’ book that says it’s okay to have two dads, or saying that extending human rights to trans people will legalize sexual assaults on women and children.

    • Jake
    • March 27th, 2013

    Spin spin spin.

    First of all, trans folk have human rights, so get off that soap box. Gays do, too. It’s wanting MORE rights than other people that just doesn’t sit well with some.

    The rights of Christians are being attacked (you do a fine job yourself) by the twisting of facts. Whatcott was fired, fined, physically assaulted, banned from living in his own house, and officially denied his freedom of speech – all because other people didn’t like his opinions.

    Opinions. Free speech. You have them, so why can’t Whatcott? In fact, Whatcott sticks to facts, while you exaggerate and even lie to make your points. But go ahead, it’s your right to be wrong (until the SCC strips you of your right to free speech, as well).

    Example of your twisting of facts: the “Christian Pride” events that you cite do not cost hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars, nor promote activity that maims and kills our youth and costs millions more in taxpayer dollars in medical costs every year.

    And get off the book-banning meme. RKR (Simpson) never opposed the Surrey 3 books; she opposed a one-sided curriculum that failed to warn of ANY negative ramifications of the gay lifestyle. She’s very clearly on record as supporting balanced LGBT information that will encourage health, life, civility, and equality for all. She’s even offered a bounty to anyone who can prove otherwise.

    As for me, I’ve taken the slurs and beatings of anti-gay bigots my whole life, and I recognize their narrow-minded hatred in your hurtful words, as well. Try a little love, sympathy, and empathy for your fellow humans for a change. Stop lying to make made-up points. You think you’re clever and heroic, but you’re just mean and underhanded.

    • dentedbluemercedes
    • March 27th, 2013

    Obviously, we’re not going to agree. A few last thoughts:

    “It’s wanting MORE rights than other people”

    Nope. It’s about wanting to see a doctor without being refused treatment (which happens to trans people — I regularly get requests from folks who have been in this situation). It’s about being a model employee with excellent evaluations for years, and then suddenly being laid off as a “troublemaker” when transitioning. It’s about trying to make schools safe for kids who are experiencing the same outright harassment and violence that I once did. It’s about wanting to spread awareness so that spouses, families, friends and society don’t reject people because they’re LGBT. You can pretend that these things don’t happen, but I encounter people who experience them daily.

    I have no problem with a person living, believing and conducting their lives as they wish to — just do not infringe on others’ ability to do the same.

    “… Whatcott was fired, fined, physically assaulted, banned from living in his own house, and officially denied his freedom of speech – all because other people didn’t like his opinions.”

    I don’t support assaulting anyone, and wouldn’t support firing them for their beliefs — although if they were regularly harassing people with those beliefs to the point where it created a hostile workplace for others, that becomes a different story. Where Bill Whatcott oversteps is fliering neighbourhoods and campuses with claims that gays assault children and graphic depictions that make a hostile environment inevitable. In most cases, I do not support bans: I would rather (as I’ve done above) point out others’ agendas and bigotry, and challenge it. I believe that to be more effective.

    “Example of your twisting of facts: the “Christian Pride” events that you cite do not cost hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars”

    You do realize that Christian-focused charities, schools, Christmas celebrations and programs receive far more government funding than any Pride parade ever could, right?

    “activity that maims and kills our youth and costs millions more in taxpayer dollars in medical costs every year.”

    Seriously? Citations, please. And if you’re talking about HIV, keep in mind that unprotected sex is a greater factor than sexual orientation in its spread, and silencing the “gay agenda” doesn’t address that.

    “… She’s very clearly on record as supporting balanced LGBT information that will encourage health, life, civility, and equality for all. She’s even offered a bounty to anyone who can prove otherwise.”

    That’s because she defines “balanced” as arriving at a conclusion in which LGBT people are mentally ill, need to be cured and are a medical threat to society.

    • Jake
    • March 27th, 2013

    You’re right, we’ll never agree. You’re too focused on cherry picking parts of the truth – and making up your own “facts” – so that you always “win” your argument. I guess you like the role of victim too much. Sad.

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